[00:00:00] Speaker A: Foreign.
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[email protected] and now here's your host, Ler.
[00:00:21] Speaker A: Hello once again, everyone, back with casual talk radio. I'll go ahead and wish you preemptively a happy New Year's. That'll be the next time that we speak, will be 2025. I really ate nothing since lazy. That'll be the quote that I'll share at that time.
I'm gonna this will be a slimmer episode. I've, I've stumbled across some chatter that I thought was good as a subject, but there's not a lot I want to talk about. I wanted to share some thoughts and feedback and there's two primary topics and I had to decide and I figured this one was quick enough. It's right on the top of the mind. It's easy lowing in fruit.
So here's the background. There's an article from ABC News. It was a coverage to I think they showed on TV as well. But they were talking about the decline in population in attendance for churches. And they went around, did some interviews with various churches. And we're talking about, you know, getting feedback from kind of what do you think is the root cause of this? And it's been going on a long time. It's not specific to us. It's worldwide.
And I would say to a tee. The various religious leaders all said the same thing, which was that in times of, you know, in good times, in times of wealth, in times of positive things, there's less of a acceptance of religion.
Not that you don't believe it's there, don't believe there's a value, but you don't seem to need it as in people go when there's a need. So they called out 911 that immediately after 911 that the attendance was sky high, that people wanted something to believe. And one of them even said, you know, people fall back to religion when they need it, not necessarily just as a way of life. It's when you need it and you take for granted. And then when it's gone, you're like, hey, what happened? And so it got me thinking.
The church traditionally, and this is any religion, it doesn't matter which, but the church traditionally has long since held to some of the edicts that have been there. Prior to a world of technology, right prior to the win, the money was more the priority. We, we turned into kind Of a money farm. The. The whole. Bishop Bullwinkle, who passed away a while ago, and he did songs about how there's all sorts of scandals in the church. We all know that there's scandals in every church. They have been from, you know, the. What's the guy's name? I forgot the guy's name.
Cash something. Cash. Cash Flow, something like that. And he's just flossing and flaunting. And there's preachers buying massive houses. The whole joke from don't be a menace. Oh, why come the preacher can't have himself a nice house? Oh, why come to preach? You can have himself a nice car.
The jokes are out about the religious leaders and how they take money. Right? Get that played around that side. The jokes are out. Well, if there was no basis to it, there would not be jokes. Everybody knows these are a thing. It's not that they're in every church, but they're still a thing. That is a subject of ridicule. And it is true that people and I. I blame the.
I think I blame social media for some of this, but it is true that the spirit aspect of religion is lost. Like, if you think of relationships, and I'll even use some of mine as a great example in the past, when you meet somebody, they either are or are not or say they are. I should say or don't, that they're religious.
A lot of times, ones will say that they're religious, but they're not really religious. They go to church, they go to the physical building. They might sing some songs, but they're not religious. There's a saying, it's not about the building. It's about the people.
It's about the faith. It's about practicing what you're taught.
The building doesn't really mean anything, but you have a lot of people who just go to the building because that's what they do. I met a girl years ago, and she was brought by another person to church.
And I talked to that girl much later. Now, I had the major crush on this girl for no reason I could understand. But she's cool people. We're just different people.
But she would go just because she's going with a friend. That's a lot of these, you see that they're going with a friend, or they're going just because the parents say to go, or they're going because something they. They believe that that's what they should do.
But when they're prosperous, right, when the work's working good, they're paid really good, the job's really good, they're happy, which is never a permanent state.
Then all of a sudden, and one of the parishioners called this out, all of a sudden, church becomes the lower priority. They don't have time to go. They have other things to do.
In most traditional religions, that's the reason for Sunday. Set aside and take an hour or however long to attend Sunday mass, say, or whatever service. And not a lot of time to invest. You should be able to do it. You don't have to work. It's not a business day.
But people still have their other stuff that they claim they have to do in lieu of going to the church. And I've said, because this is how I work.
I don't think that the structure of the traditional church system works for everybody. But many people are not brave enough to simply outright admit what they believe or what they feel or what they think about it. Like, many of the people that don't go, that stopped going, have done so because they are disenfranchised. They don't feel.
One of the people interviewed, some of the attendees said, this is like family to us, but they're older. You're talking 50s, 60s for them, it's like a family. And they treat it like I'm coming together with family that not blood related, but we all have this that we come together and work in. We do giveaways and everything together, but we're like family. We talk and we do these things.
The younger generation, you can't even convince them to get out of their phones. You can't even convince them to shut off social media. I actually saw a boxer. His name's Mikal Fox. Young kid.
I don't think much of him as a boxer, but he came out recently as with an article and he said, you know, I started getting into audiobooks, which I hadn't done before, and it's helped me speak better, it's helped me learn how to express myself better. And I really like it. Instead of listening to music that has no real value, I'm getting value out of listening to these audiobooks. Culture, and some of that is you raise kids to believe and do these things. In the olden days, that's to pick up a physical book. Doesn't matter if it's a physical book or an audio book or something, but something that enriches you. And many people consider church to be one of those sources of enrichment, depending on the situation. But what's happened, and I think all of us echo this sentiment, clearly losing all the people interviewed is that church became a crutch for certain people. That's what they fall back on in times of trouble, in times of strife. They go and look for something to believe in and something to put their faith in when they need it. They called out how some of these churches and chapels and things, you're talking historical buildings turned into bars and all these, quote, sinful things. It's almost, it's very close to the story in Sodom and Gomorrah. If you go read that, if in Christianity, if you read about that story, it's very similar, what you see. But also with Sodom and Gomorrah, if you understand what that those two imply.
I'm not going to go there because I'm trying to keep pg. But if you go think about what those imply, the transgender push, I'm talking the push, not rights. I'm talking the push how it's shoved everywhere. How it shoved in the, in the kids system and the, the ones on the White House that were flashing their tops and attacking people, pushing their agendas, dancing in women's bathrooms, all of that. The, the gay couple that had sex in the White House. And you look at all these different things and then you see what they're doing to the churches and it gets in the fires and stuff, and it gets very close to what's described in Sodom and Gomorrah. Now you. You hear me say that and you're like, well, how do you know that story? Well, I know that story because there was a time when I read the Bible as a book because I wanted to understand the stories and read the stories and hear some of the stories that were told in the Bible itself.
But later I got to the point of reality for me, which is I gotta have faith in myself, because if I don't have faith in myself, it doesn't matter what else I believe. And turned it into my own religion of a sort that I've advertised to different people that doesn't require you to do anything.
Some understand.
They have that same mentality. They just couldn't describe it. They couldn't put it into words. The idea that they kind of put themselves first.
Some are just anti church. See, I'm not anti church. I believe that a lot of religions, there's pieces you can pull from each and every one of them to create your own religious belief system. I don't fashion any religion, any one religion over another. I don't say this one over here is the definitive. And that's all I Believe. I don't support what certain religions say and do about other people. Like, some religions are anti lesbianism, right? Some religions literally believe in castration. Some religions believe in burning. If you do certain sins, there's things people don't want to talk about that are not acceptable. And then people see, like what's happening with the Catholic Church and the investigation of child abuse in the churches. People see these things, and a lot of it's all been there for decades.
Social media promotes it, promotes it in a positive light in some cases. Because if you think about all the different preachers that were out there promoting all these big buildings and houses and cars and all that stuff, media promotes that, social media promotes that. And people see that and some people roll along with it, and some people are disgusted by it.
So this story got me thinking.
We can never go back to what churches used to be. It's not. It's never going to happen. You can never go back to that era where the church is one of those mainstays of a growing family that's in development. We can never go back to the world of a Martin Luther King era where the church is. There's a reliance on it to support the era that we're in. We don't have that narrative anymore.
But I also don't support the extreme left shift that's happened, which is to turn the government into a deity of sort where you're reliant on them to keep you, you know, satisfied. Because that's a trap, number one. Number two, you're not supposed to worship false idols. And the government is essentially a false idol if they're asking for your worship. We just saw in the past four years Joe Biden essentially taking on the shape of a false idol because he threatened people up on the air expecting and freely gave away money and expected people to just bow down and support the government and take away your individual rights and freedoms because you're expecting somebody to worship you and only you and not your own. That was never the right answer. But that's what we dealt with for four years now. Fast forward.
Churches are struggling. Attendance is down.
I started asking the question, and this is what I wanted to do on the episode. Now that I've set the foundation, I started to ask the question, what are some of the things that. Since we know we can't go back to the old times, what are some of the things that the church. And I see that in generic form. I don't refer to a church by the building. I refer to the congregation. The People, what is it that the church normally can and should contribute to society that has nothing to do with the religion itself and is still compatible in the modern world? Here's where Scientology got it right and has done. Scientology by and large has been in the community since its inception. Scientology is out there doing good.
Say what you will about the negative things that have been said about them and some proven, but Scientology is out in the community. So got me thinking. One of these, I believe it's a prisoner talked about how they had as a church, they had a lot of land and they chose to because they were told or encouraged to. But I think it's a great idea. They were told to take some of the land that was actually very valuable land and build housing upon it. And that helps them generate money to sustain what they're doing?
Well, think about some of the normal behaviors of the church from a community perspective. Assist the sick and the poor, assist people that are homeless. Try to contribute back to the community rather than be a drain upon it. Remember, the government provides all sorts of tax benefits to churches. Remember, just being a church by its very nature entitles you to a lot of savings in various areas that the regular businesses can't touch. So there's already this narrative that we have to kind of subsidize, partially subsidize the presence of churches because they can't self sustain reasonably. They can only live so much off tides, right?
But regardless of how much the government subsidizes, it still isn't enough. It simply took a long time for that bubble to burst. Here we are. So when I saw this lady's idea, it got me thinking. Why don't other churches do the same thing? And I'm not suggesting that all of them have land, but there's other ways that you can contribute and do the same thing. Even if it meant taking out loans or doing other things to get by. But getting creative with the definition of what the church is providing back to the community.
Think about it for a minute.
There are some churches that do food bank type programs, right? They'll offer food to the homeless and do different types of things. What if you simply set up a full on food bank, which is a nonprofit, generally, usually nonprofit food bank.
Then you partner that up with an actual for profit business for those that are homeless. That's a place to stay, like a hoteling type of situation, A place to stay, place to get a shower, place to get some simple meals if you need it, place to get training for jobs, place to help you with a Resume, get set up place to do some basic Internet, working with the local library to make access to reading and learning and greater education more available to people. What if you took the fact that you are an establishment in the community and used that reputation to do outreaches to the various schools that are struggling? There are schools whose scores are an absolute joke in terms of the performance of the children.
Where is the partnership between the church and the school to try to help that instead of the pushback? I see where some don't want religious in the schools. I understand why you think you don't, but schools are struggling. Churches are struggling. What happens if they work together? What happens if the church works with local law enforcement in order to help reform work so that we don't have this high rate of recidivism that we see in the legal system? There's so many opportunities that I don't think churches are availing themselves of by using the reputation as a mainstay in the community to purposely go out instead of waiting and saying, we're here if you want to stop by and join our congregation. Instead, they take proactive steps to reach out to all these other ones that are struggling and. And be that cornerstone of the community. I would love to see the church helping with the schools, partnering up with the schools. You don't have to advocate any one religion to do that. You can simply be a voice for positive and talk about all the things that you don't like seeing in the school system today. By the way, we just had that school shooting take place which might have been avoided, we don't know, but might have been avoided by simply having religious presence. This was a actual Christian school.
As a Christian school, how is it possible that you can have this type of a shooting take place? Is that Christian school really following the edicts of Christianity or are there gaps in learning that might have helped avoid what happened? This is spitball. I don't know. I wasn't there. I'm saying, do they practice everything that they're supposed to? Have they strayed in some places? Is the church working with them? There's all sorts of opportunity there to learn from what's happened and hopefully avoid it in the future, as well as to try to work with those children and their parents outside of the school, working with the families on a regular basis to try to keep. Let's say that the. I don't know if she was coming from a bad family or not, but I suspect she probably was. How embedded is that? Because if you're sending your Kid to a Christian school, you must assume as a fair assumption that there's some welcomeness to, you know, some church presence. Well, was the church presence there? And if not, why not? And if not, what? If you simply offer that as part of the partnering with the school to offer it to the families and things. These I talk about, right? Making available just places for somebody that needs to get a clean place and shower up and get ready for a job or something. Making networking available. Networking is a huge thing. The idea that you just have people that are available and just need to be able to have these contacts to reach out to for different things. I'll give you a great example. It is the darndest thing to just get basic contractors who want the work, who want to get paid, but who are not trying to rip you off and who are willing to do it. Right. I just dealt with that where she's trying to have me fill out a frickin form and I already told her what I want. She gave me a quote. Great, great. Just show up to give me a firm quote. Well, we need you to fill out this whole full page. No, I'm not filling out your full page form. You don't need to do that. Come out here, come take a look at what it is. Provide me a firm quote. You gave me a starting number. I need a firm quote that's in writing that I'll agree to. We get it done and you can make a deal. Can't find it. Consider what the church could offer in that regard. Because you bring people together by your very nature. You could have the woodworking person, you could have the metal working person, you could have the electrician person, you could have somebody who's certified in different things now partnered up with somebody who happens to need those services. Now you're benefiting them financially, but you're also benefiting yourself as a community and as congregation.
In summary, I believe as a personal thought process that a lot of what we see in the decline of church population is a byproduct of the different things we see that are negative we don't agree with in the church system. And I understand that. I do think though that part of the blame has to lie with the various church systems that don't proactively outreach to other places to keep that exposure and kind of evolve with the times. You can no longer be just that. We're just sitting over here in the corner and we're here if you need us. You have to outreach and say we're going to be out and reach to people, because we understand that that's. That's one thing, at least in the past, that's one thing Jehovah's Witnesses did well versus all the other ones. Outreach, constant outreach. Scientology, constant outreach, constant face out in the community.
All of them. That's one thing I think that they never got is this. You got to evolve with the times. It's a different era.
And you can do more. I know some do some, that's great. But you can do more because you have that outlet, you have that opportunity. You had that voice. You have some recognition.
I don't think the era of expecting significant in the congregation up front is. I think we're past that. I think now you simply have to increase exposure by way of your being present at these different avenues, and then maybe you do get what you expect in return. I can't say that's what I feel about it.
So I am not going to tell you that any one religion is good, bad, right, wrong, or indifferent. Each one has different parts and pieces that are positive. Each one has things that are really not good.
Everybody's got to choose what makes sense for them. I will just say, from my experience, a lot of people, especially women, a lot of people use the church system as a crutch. It is when they've been hurt, when they're angry about something, when they lose their job, when they miscarry, whatever it is some sort of traumatic situation. That's when they lean on the church, not as a part of their life. And so the disappointment that comes when there are these events and they expect instant gratification, that disappointment then becomes what it becomes. Animus, anger, frustration, disappointment. That affects you, as in your life, and you're not able to get past it. And that, that behavior, that emotion, those reactions, are what puts you in the situation of needing help in the first place. Needing help is what makes you desperate. Desperation makes you rely on the government to take care of you, which begets socialism. We can say all that and you can disagree. But consider.
Why do you think socialism even became a thing in the first place? It became a thing because people wanted to have something and someone take care of them, because for whatever reason, they were unwilling or unable to take care of themselves.
That's why.
So when the church system did not reveal the instant gratification they expected. I pray and put my hands together and I pray and I expect to get a windfall of money.
It wasn't reality. But that's unfortunately why people lose faith, because they don't Get a result.
They don't get a result because they don't understand that they're not supposed to get a result directly by something that you ask for. Katt Williams talked about it.
What you believe and that faith you have to expect, you're not going to get anything from it.
Things will happen, but it's ultimately by way of your actions and inactions and behaviors and way that you treat life.
And then there's going to be a causality from it. What you do will or won't result in something. If you rob a bank, you're going to get some negative outcomes about that. You might feel good for a minute, but you're going to get negative outcomes about that. If you adopt a child, you might feel good up front, but it might turn into a very bad thing on the back end or it might not. It's all causality.
All that you can expect from that connection is if you go all in and you make it part of your life and you say, it is part of my life and it is not something where I'm expecting instant gratification out of it, you might realize positive outcomes. But if you go in it, as these have stated, you go in it because something traumatic has happened and that's the only time that you fall back on it. Well, what does that mean? That means that essentially you're a fickle, you know, fickle person. You're just going for your own self gratification, selfishness.
Why do you think then you don't hear that response? Why do you think you don't hear anything back? Because you're only going when you think you need it.
Those that are turning this stuff into bars and everything else, well, consider why that is, is because the building is nice. That's all. They think of it as a building. It was never part of them as a congregation.
It's interesting that this happened, all this that they're talking about. And yet you still, you still have the Masons out there, the Freemasons and, you know, and the brotherhoods and they're still as loyal as you think that they should be. But they don't have the hard fast religion at all.
Their whole thing is about the family aspect and about the camaraderie aspect and about the loyalty aspect. That's what keeps them together.
There are dues, there's the whole same concept that you might have in the churches, but it's less of a focus on we need money to grow or we need people to keep this thing going. That's never what it's really about.
I'm not trying to tell you what is right or wrong. I'm not trying to tell you what's good or bad, because there's good and bad and everything I am saying.
As for anybody who's attending, leading, managing, promoting, following a church that is struggling. When I say struggling, I mean struggling.
Some have land to spare, some do not.
Some have money to spare, some do not. Some don't have those types of resources.
That doesn't mean that you cannot do more out in the community than you are and just think differently. You can connect resources to resources. You can be supportive for job, the jobless, the job hunters. You can be a conduit for help for people who are feeling suicidal, for people who are feeling hurt or frustrated or angry or sad or at the verge.
You can be a safe space to some degree.
You can be that, that ear for things. You can do more that evolves the nature of what church means beyond the building.
You can consider working with lenders and government and everything else to set up places that actually help in your community.
Even if you did nothing more than try to work to build homes for the homeless.
I'm not suggesting it's easy. I'm suggesting that you can. We know that you can because it's been done and it's done all the time.
But I don't think it's the priority.
I don't think it's the first thing you think of. But isn't that part of the mission to help?
I'm just suggesting another form of help and that you don't necessarily have to fund it out of pocket. There's ways that you can help fund something like that and then build ways to recoup some of that on the back end. If you build affordable housing, for example, affordable housing, if you take out something where you can pay it back by way of the people that are taking advantage of the housing, toss a little something that's helping the church. Everybody benefits. You just have to be wise about it and consult, you know, the people on the financial side who can help you kind of make the numbers work. I'm not suggesting that's easy. I'm suggesting it's possible. There's grant money out there that could do it, but maybe you can't do it by yourself and you have to have somebody else that sits down and runs the numbers and finds those services. I'm stressing to you that they're out there. As someone who has availed myself from a business perspective of those funding arms, I can guarantee you it is a lot easier for churches to get access to that types of money. As long as you have a strong case for what it is that you're trying to do and you're not trying to pull Creflo$, that's that idiot's name, as long as you're not trying to pull his nonsense. There's resources out there for you to make a difference and evolve, modernize the concept of what the church brings to the system.
Who all are.
